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Wow.

Submitted by Rick on Wed, 02/13/2008 - 11:33am.

How come?

> It's OK to be nice. <
enpen's social contract

Perhaps someone died waiting in line

Submitted by Guglielmo on Wed, 02/13/2008 - 11:49am.

Seriously, I'm sorry to see it close. While I haven't patronized the place in some time, I remember many a Sunday morning sipping coffee and eating a garlic baggel with walnut and olive cream cheese while looking at the killer whales across the street.

Practical men, who believe themselves to be quite exempt from any intellectual influence, are usually the slaves of some defunct economist.! --John Maynard Keynes

That's a bummer. I wonder

Submitted by OperaGirl on Wed, 02/13/2008 - 11:55am.

That's a bummer. I wonder why they shut down?

Music is the mediator between the spiritual and the sensual life. ~Ludwig van Beethoven

word on the street is...

Submitted by einmaleins on Wed, 02/13/2008 - 12:19pm.

...money was an issue.

speaking of money

Submitted by enpen on Wed, 02/13/2008 - 12:39pm.

Is it just me or do the rents in downtown Olympia seem prohibitively high for small local businesses? I've read that Olympia has/had a 15% vacancy rate which is deemed acceptable. The only local thing I turned up on numbers was the Business Examiner's write up on Pierce County. According to it Pierce County (the entire thing) had commercial vacancy rates of 6.75% in 2007. Fife was their high at 14.29%.

I think the rental rates in downtown Olympia are cost prohibitive for too many local entrepreneurs which leads to an increase in vacant commercial spaces. Why are the downtown commercial real estate owners willing to accept the loss of income from so many vacancies?

"In principle, I am an anarchist. Kurt Vonnegut once said he was an agnostic who respects Jesus Christ. I am an anarchist who loves democracy." - Kenzaburo Oe

well that's a good question.

Submitted by einmaleins on Wed, 02/13/2008 - 1:19pm.

... they base their rent prices on the possibilty of what Olympia could become, rather than what it is. Unfortuantely there's hardly anyone really taking steps in turning that possiblity into reality. Olympia can be great, and we're already paying for it, but we don't have it yet... m.

I don't like that

Submitted by enpen on Wed, 02/13/2008 - 1:23pm.

It seems inorganic and unsustainable.

"In principle, I am an anarchist. Kurt Vonnegut once said he was an agnostic who respects Jesus Christ. I am an anarchist who loves democracy." - Kenzaburo Oe

believe me...

Submitted by einmaleins on Wed, 02/13/2008 - 1:30pm.

I don't like it either...

But, (this is almost becoming worthy of starting a new thread)

I talked to several other business owners around and we're all feeling the cruel reality of the economic forces all the way from the top right now.

If that continues, Otto's will be the first and not the last to go.

PS: Did you receive the DOWNTOWN SHOPPER flyer in yesterdays mail??

einmaleins

Its a beaut

Submitted by Katherine on Wed, 02/13/2008 - 2:27pm.

Love the mailer. I got it today, though. Very exciting. I hope that we can find a way to make is sustainable so Nate & Sarah can go get married already!

One explaination is that

Submitted by Guglielmo on Wed, 02/13/2008 - 1:32pm.

property owners maximize expected rental income by forgoing low-rent leases in favor of the possibility of landing someone willing to pay considerably more. Doesn't make it "right." Just is. They are "speculative" vacancies in the landlords property portfolio.

Practical men, who believe themselves to be quite exempt from any intellectual influence, are usually the slaves of some defunct economist.! --John Maynard Keynes

This deserves its own piece.

Submitted by Ehver Green on Wed, 02/13/2008 - 10:07pm.

This deserves its own piece.

Not to sound cruel...

Submitted by YLlama on Wed, 02/13/2008 - 12:31pm.

...but good riddance. Otto's bagels were terrible. Sub-grocery store, if that's possible.

judging from a outside perspective....

Submitted by einmaleins on Wed, 02/13/2008 - 12:38pm.

... weekends they were always full....

my money

Submitted by noradarno on Wed, 02/13/2008 - 2:02pm.

I don't mind the bagels at ottos. However I always hated waiting in line due to poor, chatty service, only to be the first person in line and watch your waiter walk past you for five minutes talking about utter bullshit.

After a while, me and my wife had enough and stopped going there because of their craptastic service. While some places are nice when employees take ownership, literally and figuratively, it only ruined ottos potential.

When Gene sold it to his employees, because of rumored differences in opperational opinion, the writing had to be on the wall.

I still love and support SF Bakery however.

I loved their bagels but

Submitted by Merwyn Haskett on Wed, 02/13/2008 - 2:19pm.

I loved their bagels but experienced the same "service" you described. I've also gotten the same treatment at Batdorf and Bronson which is why I don't go there anymore.

It is true that I've gotten crappy service at The Brotherhood and The Reef and I still count them as my favorite spots. I've gone often enough to realize that at those locations it was the exception rather than the rule.

Now take a little while to find your way in here
Now take a little while to make your story clear.
Nick Drake

Terrible service. Precisely

Submitted by NWarty on Wed, 02/13/2008 - 2:22pm.

Terrible service. Precisely the reason I won't go to Dancing Goats anymore. I can't count how many times I gave them a second chance.

Sorry, just had to get that rant out of me :)

The employees did not own Otto's

Submitted by Rob Richards on Wed, 02/13/2008 - 3:24pm.

It was sold to a man from Tacoma. They're Laotian, I've seen them around since the place sold.

I stand corrected. I guess

Submitted by noradarno on Wed, 02/13/2008 - 5:18pm.

I stand corrected. I guess my source was wrong then. I appologize

Ottos

Submitted by Robert Whitlock on Wed, 02/13/2008 - 2:06pm.

Sad to hear that Otto's is closing. I liked the bagels. I am surprised to hear that it is closing because of money issues, because it seemed to be busy most of the time.

I don't know the specifics...

Submitted by jlw on Wed, 02/13/2008 - 2:21pm.

... but I know that the place changed ownership around 6 months ago... Now this. It makes me sad. I used to go to Otto's to study; I would drink coffee and read something that would have put me to sleep at home. Plus, those booths in the back are a good place for relatively private conversation. The tables are so close at certain other downtown bakeries that it's impossible to speak freely -- although sometimes the eavesdropping is interesting.

This world's crazy, give me the gun. -- P.J. Harvey

Poor service is the reason I stopped going to Otto's

Submitted by Guglielmo on Wed, 02/13/2008 - 2:33pm.

The last order of "lox" didn't help either. It was the most sour, waterlogged chunk of anemic salmon that I've ever experienced. It haunts me still today. The service at B&B is fine. It's the customers who are the problem there.

Practical men, who believe themselves to be quite exempt from any intellectual influence, are usually the slaves of some defunct economist.! --John Maynard Keynes

customers

Submitted by Robert Whitlock on Wed, 02/13/2008 - 2:37pm.

What's wrong with the customers?

I'll tell you what the matter Rob

Submitted by Guglielmo on Wed, 02/13/2008 - 2:44pm.

They don't know how to stand in line
They don't realize there is a line
They wait until they get to the register to figure out what they want
They order the most complex blends of coffee regardless of the number of people standing in line behind them
They don't carry any cash
They put "dibbs" on a table before they get in line to order (and that just ain't right)
They aren't me darnit!

I'm being a just a tad facetious and crummudgeony of course. It's all good.

Practical men, who believe themselves to be quite exempt from any intellectual influence, are usually the slaves of some defunct economist.! --John Maynard Keynes

the line

Submitted by Robert Whitlock on Wed, 02/13/2008 - 2:56pm.

The line is one of my favorite things about B&B. I love the bifurcating line. It's just so equitable. I feel sort of proprietary about it, so that if someone seems to be lining up in front of a register I usually give them the look.

Oh yes. I do like the single line philosophy at B&B

Submitted by Guglielmo on Wed, 02/13/2008 - 3:00pm.

That's what brings me back for more. It's just the people who stand 10 feet back from the counter who raise my blood pressure. Now I'm starting to sound like Merwyn.;-)

Practical men, who believe themselves to be quite exempt from any intellectual influence, are usually the slaves of some defunct economist.! --John Maynard Keynes

Switch to Vita

Submitted by Rob Richards on Wed, 02/13/2008 - 3:27pm.

I'm telling you, it's worth it. Better coffee, friendlier staff, more laid back clientèle, and you can usually always find a seat.

Vita has the best drip

Submitted by Guglielmo on Wed, 02/13/2008 - 3:38pm.

and I hear they're Laotian.

Practical men, who believe themselves to be quite exempt from any intellectual influence, are usually the slaves of some defunct economist.! --John Maynard Keynes

I said that.

Submitted by Rob Richards on Wed, 02/13/2008 - 3:41pm.

If we're going to talk coffee

Submitted by Katherine on Wed, 02/13/2008 - 3:58pm.

and talk local business, you've gotta talk about Oly Coffee Roasters. They have this crazy little machine that they spend hours with in order to perfect drip coffee by the cup. You can watch them roast all their own organic, free trade beans and then get a cup of it, freshly ground, perfectly prepared with precise time and heat and delivered direct to your cup. The Cherry St. Cafe is worth the extra couple of blocks if you really want perfect coffee. Gosh... I sound like I'm shillin' for them but I'm really just a little bit in love.

I agree!

Submitted by jlw on Wed, 02/13/2008 - 5:38pm.

It IS the best coffee. But I never see anyone I know there, and for me, as a relatively isolated self-employed person, the chatter is half as important as the caffeine.

This world's crazy, give me the gun. -- P.J. Harvey

I'm there

Submitted by Katherine on Wed, 02/13/2008 - 7:46pm.

most mornings right after 9 am. I usually have one or two little boys who are trying to sneak off to play with the electric fork lift. Now there's a selling point for all you boys in these parts. Heavy machinery on premise!

the best drip?

Submitted by enpen on Thu, 02/14/2008 - 11:49pm.

In Olympia? Seriously, you guys are delusional and are obviously not coffee snobs. Vita is all about its location. Were it anywhere else it wouldn't do have the business it does in Olympia. And really, shouldn't you both be supporting the locally owned businesses anyway?

"In principle, I am an anarchist. Kurt Vonnegut once said he was an agnostic who respects Jesus Christ. I am an anarchist who loves democracy." - Kenzaburo Oe

Now I'm starting to sound

Submitted by Merwyn Haskett on Wed, 02/13/2008 - 3:59pm.

Now I'm starting to sound like Merwyn

Do you have any numbers to back that up? :-P

Now take a little while to find your way in here
Now take a little while to make your story clear.
Nick Drake

Working on a Merwyn Equivalence Index

Submitted by Guglielmo on Wed, 02/13/2008 - 4:05pm.

I'll let you know when I got the bugs worked out.

Practical men, who believe themselves to be quite exempt from any intellectual influence, are usually the slaves of some defunct economist.! --John Maynard Keynes

flour prices

Submitted by the original ep on Wed, 02/13/2008 - 5:04pm.

Flour has been raising by leaps and bounds,(at least organic) six months ago 50\$18.00 today 50/ $38.00 All costs are skyrocketing while people are spending less money, we are in and inflationary recession. We have admitted the recession but are in denial as of yet as to the inflation. The tax bills rarely slow down with business either. Harder than ever to make it.

Biofuel industry partly to blame I think.

Submitted by Guglielmo on Wed, 02/13/2008 - 5:07pm.

Practical men, who believe themselves to be quite exempt from any intellectual influence, are usually the slaves of some defunct economist.! --John Maynard Keynes

dang, and I just started baking my own bread....

Submitted by einmaleins on Wed, 02/13/2008 - 5:22pm.

... and buying large bags of flour...

well, the end is near... ;-)

mathias

einmaleins

Back on the Otto's thing...

Submitted by The Original Yoda on Wed, 02/13/2008 - 7:08pm.

...A few years ago, I used to get a sesame toasted with hummus every weekday. At first, I found the service to be slow and slightly rude, especially Vicki.

I don't know how it happend. Maybe it's cause I always smiled and said please and thankyou. Or that I tipped everyday.

But by the end, Vicki was putting faces on my bagels made out of black olives and carrot strips.

Anyhoo...I stopped going there when an employee wouldn't let me hang up a my band flier even though there was space to be had. Flier edicate is a topic for another thread, though.

I thought their bagels were good and a bit lopsided as of late but they fixed that. I'll miss that place. I had just started going back there...

Never even knew they existed...

Submitted by security_six on Wed, 02/13/2008 - 7:10pm.

But for whatever reason some parts of downtown are more or less blank in my mind. Plus I'm not a huge bagel eater. Sometimes I stop in at the Bread Peddler though. I love the fact they actually serve tea with a teapot, not a mug with a bag floating in it.

The story so far: In the beginning, the Universe was created. This has made a lot of people mad and been widely regarded as a bad idea. -The Restaurant at the end of the Universe

Mmmmm.... walnut olive cream cheese!

Submitted by Katherine on Wed, 02/13/2008 - 7:38pm.

I've never been able to replicate it, so it must have something to do with Otto's itself. Otto's has always been the epitome of Olympia's take on customer service-- some really bright spots (last time there was a very nice young man) but mostly overly-snarked people who seem genuinely bitter that existence requires employment. I've used Otto's service, and Vicki in particular, as an example of what not to do when hiring and training people.

I'm wondering what will happen to that space? It seems so hard to fill vacancies downtown.

well... who has the guts??

Submitted by einmaleins on Thu, 02/14/2008 - 9:50am.

Do we need another Bagel-shop in Downtown Olympia. Where are all the Entrepeneur's ... there's you're opportunity!! mathias

My take

Submitted by girly_grrlb on Thu, 02/14/2008 - 10:33pm.

Since many of the older employees left after the business was sold, I've found that the service was much better. Yes, a lot of waiting around in line (but hey, they're not waiters, and it's not like they were sitting around ignoring me), but I wait at San Fran. St. every day I go in there also. I'm just sad for the employees, the Oly folk's who'll miss it, and the new owners who poured so much into the business. And believe me, the owners were there, working, every single day.

Otto's

Submitted by Sarah on Sun, 02/24/2008 - 3:08pm.

Otto's memorial

people are adding to it

Submitted by enpen on Fri, 03/21/2008 - 2:48pm.

"In principle, I am an anarchist. Kurt Vonnegut once said he was an agnostic who respects Jesus Christ. I am an anarchist who loves democracy." - Kenzaburo Oe

I overheard a conversation at the San Francisco Street ...

Submitted by The Original Yoda on Fri, 03/21/2008 - 2:51pm.

...Bakery which led me to believe a lawsuit might be in the works...

File my comment under "gossip".

lawsuit?

Submitted by enpen on Fri, 03/21/2008 - 2:54pm.

Gossip glasses on: lawsuit over what?

"In principle, I am an anarchist. Kurt Vonnegut once said he was an agnostic who respects Jesus Christ. I am an anarchist who loves democracy." - Kenzaburo Oe

Perhaps, former employees...

Submitted by The Original Yoda on Fri, 03/21/2008 - 2:58pm.

...suing the owners for "running the place into the ground".

I definitely heard "running the place into the ground"...

How on earth does one sue an owner

Submitted by Guglielmo on Fri, 03/21/2008 - 3:03pm.

for going "running their own business into the ground?" And why would they do such a thing on purpose? I know, I know...tHere are all those movies about shady baseball team owners who want their teem to lose so they can sell out and move. But Otto's? I know, the rumor mill probably can't answer that question?

well...

Submitted by enpen on Fri, 03/21/2008 - 3:03pm.

...that would suck. Speaking of which, I think I'll look into a similar suit with the utility pole companies...

"In principle, I am an anarchist. Kurt Vonnegut once said he was an agnostic who respects Jesus Christ. I am an anarchist who loves democracy." - Kenzaburo Oe

that was terrible.

Submitted by Rob Richards on Fri, 03/21/2008 - 3:08pm.

yes, yes it was

Submitted by enpen on Fri, 03/21/2008 - 3:09pm.

A sick kid and reading through today's comment threads does strange things to a man.

"In principle, I am an anarchist. Kurt Vonnegut once said he was an agnostic who respects Jesus Christ. I am an anarchist who loves democracy." - Kenzaburo Oe

Oh, is that little sweetie sick?

Submitted by jlw on Fri, 03/21/2008 - 3:18pm.

Don't you hate that? I hope you and her mother are well. There are few things worse than being sick with a sick kid... and nobody to send out for Nyquil and miso! Phoebe sends sympathy!

I'm an easy target

Submitted by enpen on Fri, 03/21/2008 - 3:37pm.

And her various ailments seem to have dad seeking capabilities. Mom is healthy. There goes her weekend :-).

"In principle, I am an anarchist. Kurt Vonnegut once said he was an agnostic who respects Jesus Christ. I am an anarchist who loves democracy." - Kenzaburo Oe

Oh....

Submitted by jlw on Fri, 03/21/2008 - 5:41pm.

Get well soon! And convey my condolences to Mom.

no it wasn't...

Submitted by The Original Yoda on Fri, 03/21/2008 - 3:10pm.

...wanna fight?

hee hee

wait a minute

Submitted by enpen on Fri, 03/21/2008 - 3:11pm.

I thought Yoda was always the last person to activate his lightsaber...

"In principle, I am an anarchist. Kurt Vonnegut once said he was an agnostic who respects Jesus Christ. I am an anarchist who loves democracy." - Kenzaburo Oe

Just making light...

Submitted by The Original Yoda on Fri, 03/21/2008 - 3:24pm.

...of the recent trend to fight.

whatever

Submitted by enpen on Fri, 03/21/2008 - 3:28pm.

There's a mud puddle with your face all over it, chump.

"In principle, I am an anarchist. Kurt Vonnegut once said he was an agnostic who respects Jesus Christ. I am an anarchist who loves democracy." - Kenzaburo Oe

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